On Wednesday’s CNN This Morning, anchors Phil Mattingly and Pamela Brown complained about FBI director Christopher Wray’s impending oversight hearing with the House Judiciary Committee panel. Along with several guests, including CNN political correspondent Sara Murray, CNN congressional correspondent Lauren Fox, and CNN legal analyst Elliot Williams, they whined about the Republicans’ “bluster” in the what was to come and how they were making the hearing “all about politics” rather than “making government work better,” as though those two were mutually exclusive.
Mattingly began the segment by describing how Wray would be “grilled by some of his harshest critics on Capitol Hill” in the hearing. He specified that it was the Republicans on the panel who would “aggressively question Wray” on the abuse of power of which the bureau had been suspected, complaining about how these Republicans had “recently threatened to hold the FBI director in contempt of Congress.”
Mattingly then brought Murray into the conversation by asking her about the “public commentary and bluster from Republicans on this panel specifically,” and the specific topics that she thought they would “go after Wray on.”
Murray claimed that she thought they would “see some more bluster today” from these House Republicans, lamenting how FBI leadership was the “number 1 punching bag” of Jim Jordan (R-OH), the chair of the Judiciary Committee. She ridiculed his criticism of the FBI’s politicization against conservatives, “because a lot of the FBI, frankly, is made up of conservatives.”
Then, Brown asked Fox for her opinion on the “expectation this is going to devolve into a food fight, rather than a hearing of substance.” Fox made speculations into the reasons for Republican interest in the hearing, chalking it up to their attempts at “protecting former President Trump”:
Instead, this is really all about politics. And there's a reason that Republicans want to bring him in, because they want to create those kinds of viral moments so they can show their conservative base back home that this is the moment that they are defending former President Donald Trump.
And that is really what this is about. This is about making that tie back to the base, that we are doing everything we can up here in Washington, up here in Congress, to make sure we are protecting former President Trump.
Williams then interjected his own opinion on the House Republicans who were on the Committee, complaining about their (in his view) conspiracy-like beliefs:
The problem right now is that there is a—a not silent majority on the House Judiciary Committee, which I testified in front of a couple months ago, that truly believes that our government is run by a deep-state cabal and in cahoots with Pfizer and Google, and all sorts of interests, that, I think, is going to get in the way of having any sort of productive hearing.
He predicted that the hearing would be “a lot of fireworks and theatrics” that would be “all about politics and not really about making government work better.”
First, this prediction ignored many of the past hearings that the Democrats had had in the past, including former President Trump’s impeachments and the January 6 Committee hearings. Second, it also assumed that these two issues of politics and government efficiency were completely separate and unrelated, which was far from the truth of the matter.
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Transcript of the segment below (click Expand):
CNN This Morning
7/12/23
6:17:19 AM ET
PHIL MATTINGLY: The FBI director, Christopher Wray, set to be grilled by some of his harshest critics on Capitol Hill. Now, Republicans on the House Judiciary Committee panel are planning to aggressively question Wray on, quote, "the abuse of power in federal agencies."
This oversight hearing is his first since Republicans recently threatened to hold the FBI director in contempt of Congress.
CNN's Sara Murray joins us now. Alright, Murray. I'm a little reticent to ask you this question, but topics-wise, we've seen a lot of public commentary and bluster from Republicans on this panel specifically. What do we expect them to go after Wray on?
SARA MURRAY: You know, it's possible you're going to see some more bluster today. Jim Jordan, the chair—
MATTINGLY: In Congress?
MURRAY: Yeah, exactly. Jim Jordan, the chair of the Judiciary Committee, has made it very clear that the FBI leadership is his number 1 punching bag, and his chief criticism is that the FBI is too politicized, particularly against conservatives, which is interesting, because a lot of the FBI, frankly, is made up of conservatives.
But I think we're going to hear about some of these high-profile investigations. I think we're going to see Wray hammered over Special Counsel John Durham's report, saying there never should have been a full investigation into Donald Trump's campaign and his ties to Russia.
Also likely to hear some of their other complaints, you know, the notion that conservative parents were overly scrutinized for their complaints around school board meetings and that kind of thing.
I mean, as you would expect, we have a very salty statement from Jerry Nadler, who is the top Democrat on the committee, who's saying, "For Republicans this hearing is little more than performance art. It is an elaborate show designed with only two purposes in mind: to protect Donald Trump from the consequences of his actions, and to return him to the White House in the next election."
But there's another threat hanging out over here, and it’s Phil's favorite. It's the appropriations process.
MATTINGLY: Appropriations.
MURRAY: Republicans are—are already threatening to cut back FBI funding. They—they want it to basically be cut back to what is absolutely essential. No politicized investigations. And are also saying, look, we don't want to give you any money for a new FBI headquarters unless you move it to Alabama.
MATTINGLY: Do we get to talk about 302B's now?
MURRAY: No. We do not.
PAMELA BROWN: Oh my God. Phil hears appropriations, and he’s like, “What? What?”
[LAUGHTER]
MURRAY: It’s too exciting.
[CROSSTALK]
MATTINGLY: So do other people that are sitting with us right now, for the record. Murray, stick around.
BROWN: Yes. And those other people are going to join us right now. CNN legal analyst and former federal prosecutor Elliot Williams, CNN congressional correspondent Lauren Fox, and senior congressional correspondent for "The Washington Post," Paul Kane.
Alright. So Lauren, look, the FBI director testifying on Capitol Hill, right? In any other universe, this would be a big deal, we would expect substance. There are threats facing our nation every day that the FBI director can speak to. But as Sara just laid out, there is every expectation this is going to devolve into a food fight, rather than a hearing of substance.
LAUREN FOX: Yeah, and this is an opportunity where lawmakers could ask a series of questions on topics that they might be interested in that might have local implications, that they might be able to get more interesting information about how an investigation is going. They might get more information about how a process is going.
Instead, this is really all about politics. And there's a reason that Republicans want to bring him in, because they want to create those kinds of viral moments so they can show their conservative base back home that this is the moment that they are defending former President Donald Trump.
And that is really what this is about. This is about making that tie back to the base, that we are doing everything we can up here in Washington, up here in Congress, to make sure we are protecting former President Trump.
ELLIOT WILLIAMS: And you know, having worked both for Congress and in law enforcement, you know, I can say, and I do believe, that congressional oversight is fundamentally a good thing for stamping out waste and fraud and abuse and helping the Justice Department or the FBI work better.
The problem right now is that there is a—a not silent majority on the House Judiciary Committee, which I testified in front of a couple months ago, that truly believes that our government is run by a deep-state cabal and in cahoots with Pfizer and Google, and all sorts of interests, that, I think, is going to get in the way of having any sort of productive hearing.
And so what you're going to see today are a lot of fireworks and theatrics and not really getting to the bottom of, is the government's money being spent well, is the FBI being run efficiently? It's all going to be about politics and not really about making government work better.
…
