Following the dropout of John Edwards, the remaining two Democratic presidential candidates are squaring off tonight at 8 on CNN (live video link).
Watch the fur fly and post your comments here or, if you are a registered NB user, join the live chat.
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No thanks, I'm depressed
January 31, 2008 - 19:32 ET by USA4freedomNo thanks, I'm depressed enough.go Mitt..
These are the boys of Pointe du Hoc. Ronald Reagan- 40th Anniversary of D-Day
me not so much
January 31, 2008 - 19:38 ET by candanceI'm still interested in seeing how much lunacy they can fit into 90 minutes.
Will Hillary agree or disagree with her husband's proposal to slow the economy for the sake of global warming?
Since the main topic here is
January 31, 2008 - 19:47 ET by Chris NormanSince the focus here is liberal media bias, I will add this to your question: Will she be even asked about it?
candance; in the spirit of the super bowl any bets going on?
January 31, 2008 - 19:50 ET by upcountrywater3: 1 even money
Bring up iraq? borders? Hsu fund raising? What are they going to talk about for 90 minutes... Oh yea cha cha change..
iranian uranium; iranian uranium, iranian uranium..
Oh joy to the world, 19 more atomic power plants!
This just in...
January 31, 2008 - 19:48 ET by c5thenMcCain refered to Justice Alito as "too conservative" only 9 months ago.
Read about it here
The day that "politician" became a career choice is the day we started losing the Republic. Let's get it back! Alan Keyes '08.
Thanks for the tip C5
January 31, 2008 - 19:57 ET by candanceWe talked about that yesterday and it did nothing to phase McCain's supporters. Also worth noting: when the press asked McCain about that quote he pulled a Hillary and said he could not recall the conversation. Bob Novak then interviewed two people who were in the room and both independently said the same story.
File "conservative judges" along with tax cuts, Al Qaeda and everything else McCain has lied about to make himself look better than Hillary.
Well, the story of my life...
January 31, 2008 - 20:14 ET by c5thenA day late and a dollar short.
I just can't believe the choices that are going to be before the American electorate this November. This is shapping up to be the worst choice for a Presidential election in my lifetime, and likely the second worst 4 years (Carter's were the worst).
The day that "politician" became a career choice is the day we started losing the Republic. Let's get it back! Alan Keyes '08.
This debate may have the
January 31, 2008 - 19:52 ET by stratmanThis debate may have the lowest number of viewers yet. ABC's Lost season opener is tonight. Even though the 8-9 PM portion is a rehash of the past three years, it still is better than listening to Hillary screech and watch her shoot laser beams from her robot eye sockets.
Well, if she did shoot out laser beams then at least I'd watch.
LOST! It's already sooo
January 31, 2008 - 21:20 ET by balboaLOST!
It's already sooo good.
It was a good episode! As
February 1, 2008 - 02:49 ET by stratmanIt was a good episode!
As usual, more questions remain than resolved.
I saw that only 8 of the total 16 episodes for the year are in the can. Hopefully the writers' strike ends so they can finish up, otherwise it's going to be another looooong wait till season 5.
Killing them with kindness isn't working. Time to get scrappy with the Donkeys.
→ LOST
February 1, 2008 - 03:08 ET by Cool ArrowIt looked like Hurley got serious silicone implants in the off season.
♣ a seal
cool -- yep, if they ever
February 1, 2008 - 05:52 ET by Jack Bauercool -- yep, if they ever run of food, Hurley is first on the spit, roasting slowly.
And I remember thinking
February 1, 2008 - 05:50 ET by Jack BauerAnd I remember thinking arrggghhh only 16 eps was disappointing as opposed to the usual 22...
Now even that seems like a bonus.
LOST -- starts here Sunday
February 1, 2008 - 05:47 ET by Jack BauerLOST -- starts here Sunday for us Others! No spoilers please!!
JB: You're not an
February 1, 2008 - 15:49 ET by stratmanJB:
You're not an "Other". You're on the beach with the rest of us Oceanic Losties.
Besides, you're JACK, though a lot less unhinged.
Enjoy the show.
Killing them with kindness isn't working. Time to get scrappy with the Donkeys.
So much for keeping gender and race out of it...
January 31, 2008 - 20:18 ET by dodecahedronWolf keeps mentioning that it's the first time that the the Democrat candidate will either be a woman or an African-American.
If the candidates really wanted to make their campaigns about "the issues" then they'd scold him for making it about race and gender.
Vote for "<insert name of conservative who stands up to the media>" for President in 2008.
You've nailed it.
January 31, 2008 - 20:57 ET by c5thenThe candidates are tacitly allowing the MSM to be their stalking horses and the MSM are eating it up. They get to seem like they are reporting while actually being active participants in the campaigns.
Hillary has always planned to be The Woman candidate. It's just her bad luck and timing to be running against The Black candidate. They're both using their "minority" status as bagdes and playing on the publics sympathy for the "poor victims".
It's really pathetic. Many liberal democrats who are all supposed to be about tolerance and acceptance and non-prejudice are voting for candidates because they are female or because they are black, or voting against them for the same reasons.
The day that "politician" became a career choice is the day we started losing the Republic. Let's get it back! Alan Keyes '08.
I'm watching it -- just a
January 31, 2008 - 21:09 ET by lotrI'm watching it -- just a bunch of mutual ass-kissing if you ask me. They are uniting to bash the Republican Party, Bush, McCain and now Mitt. They are hungry for the White House and they are well poised to take it.
It’s pretty obvious why they’re holding this debate in a theater
January 31, 2008 - 21:29 ET by dodecahedronIt's frustrating listening to these two talk. It's even more frustrating when people applaud the nonsense that comes out of their mouths. You just want to sit them down, tell them to shut up so you can talk some sense into them. I thought the level of intelligence in the debate would rise since Edwards dropped out. Nope.
Barrack starts off by sucking up to Edwards. Sounds desperate.Hillary says we can't kick illegals out of the country because it's too hard. Barrack says they should be allowed to stay and get drivers licenses once they've paid a fine. Barrack says saying that illegals take jobs away from American's is 'scapegoating.' Even Hillary isn't dumb enough to buy into that.Barrack says McCain's 'Straight-Talk Express' lost some wheels. (Oh yes, the attacks have begun).
Hillary attacks Mitt saying that having business education doesn’t help to be president – citing the fact that current president has an MBA. (Note: As someone currently finishing his BS in Business Administration with the plan to go on to an MBA, I take issue with that remark – If Democrats had business education, they’d be Republicans).
Barrack says Romney didn’t get a good ROI on his investment to run for president – the mob cheers.
Hillary says that it took one Clinton to clean up after the first Bush presidency, it’ll take another Clinton to clean up after this Bush presidency – the mob cheers wildly.
It’s pretty obvious why they’re holding this debate in a theater.
Vote for "<insert name of conservative who stands up to the media>" for President in 2008.
General Hillary
January 31, 2008 - 21:34 ET by BarkerSo Hillary wants to abandon our allies in Iraq, and then sit at the table with Iran and Syria to talk about Iraq's collapse?
Save that footage.
Hillary Needs a New Driver's License
January 31, 2008 - 21:39 ET by dodecahedronHillary needs a new kind of driver's license for all of the backseat driving she's doing.
"Well if I had been president....."
Too bad she wasn't some other kind of politician where she could have done something...maybe a U.S. Senator?
Vote for "<insert name of conservative who stands up to the media>" for President in 2008.
Great post.
January 31, 2008 - 22:20 ET by Scout FinchGreat post.
It occurs to me that the
February 1, 2008 - 06:47 ET by Pete WilsonIt occurs to me that the election of either of these two is quite similar to the election of the City Council of Berkley, CA on a national level. I am very concerned for the future of this great nation becoming a third world socialist country. See Venezuela.
That was not a debate.
January 31, 2008 - 22:08 ET by R D HelmIt was a 120 min. DNC commercial.
None are so hopelessly enslaved as those who falsely believe they are free. -J.W. von Goethe
Just a general question
January 31, 2008 - 22:18 ET by KC MulvilleI've never understood why senators running for president aren't asked this question:
McCain has proposed legislation. McCain-Feingold, McCain-Kennedy, and so on. (Oh yeah. Those went over so well.) On the other hand, what legislation has Obama or Clinton offered? If she has a healthcare plan, why hasn't she proposed it in the senate? (Oh yeah. She hasn't done anything because she's afraid of repeating her earlier disaster.) If Obama has a resolution to pull out of Iraq, why doesn't he propose it in the senate? (Oh yeah, the Democrats have proposed dozens of resolutions, all of which failed.)
All of these grand proposals and bold ideas sound great to their supporters, but you have to wonder why these candidates didn't push them as legislators. (PS: we know why. Their ideas won't work, and the legislators know it.)
good point KC
January 31, 2008 - 22:39 ET byThen again since when are the insightful questions asked?
Supreme Court, National Security, Borders, Fiscal Restraint, my litmus test for President.
the important thing (to
January 31, 2008 - 23:00 ET by TruthMongerthe important thing (to Democrats) is do they photograph well?
Who was the last senator to be elected President?
January 31, 2008 - 22:55 ET by dodecahedronThat is a good point KC. Senators run in every presidential election but I can't remember the last time one of them won. I think a lot of it has to do with your point that, if they really want change then why didn't they try to legislate change from the legislature?
Vote for "<insert name of conservative who stands up to the media>" for President in 2008.
JFK, I think.
January 31, 2008 - 23:01 ET by JerJFK, I think.
B Hussein 'Osama' Obama
January 31, 2008 - 22:23 ET by ScrapironOsama is the #1 liberal in congress, that is for the few days he has actually spent in the senate. Has anyone researched his voting record in regard to votes that would have a negative impact on his religion, Islam? Wanna bet how surprised you'll be to find he skipped more votes than anyone in history before the campaign and is seldom there since he launched his quest to be the (half black) African King of America.
Ah, the meaty, relevant,
January 31, 2008 - 23:33 ET by balboaAh, the meaty, relevant, not-dubious-at-all portion of the evening has arrived!
Hussein Osama Obama
January 31, 2008 - 23:39 ET by JudithTough talk but true. Someone has to expose this sham. He is a great speaker.........end. McCain is not my choice but I will support him because I am an American first, a Christian second, and a Republican forever. I will have zero tolerance for Repubs who sit and don't vote. Reminds me of two year olds who cry when they don't get their way. LIFE IS A CONSTANT COMPROMISE, JUST KEEP YOUR EYE ON THE BALL!
So you agree with
January 31, 2008 - 23:45 ET by JerSo you agree with Scrapiron's claim that Obama is Islamic?
Jer
BIGOT ALERT
February 1, 2008 - 00:11 ET by CTThere are some real loons that have got to go out there Jer. I'm no Obama fan, but this Islamic racebate bigotry does not belong on these boards. It makes as little sense as the Truther wackjobs, but it is hateful.
Obama is a Muslim
February 1, 2008 - 00:22 ET by Daniel BakerAccording to many Islamic people, who would consider a man with a Islamic father who attended mosque while he was young to be such. It doesn't matter to Americans, but I'm sure some radicals would want to kill a man who was a Muslim apostate and they wouldn't want to be led by his policies.
The world allows more every year, and it mostly effects marriage. Divorces will continue to go up as people are exposed to more pornography. Marriages will decrease. Children will become rare, and societies with children will take over from within
But if Obama is so
February 1, 2008 - 01:28 ET by JerBut if Obama is so "dovish" regarding the prosecution of the war on terror [as many here apparently believe], I would think the Islamic radicals would be much more desirous of eliminating George Bush or McCain rather than Obama.
Jer
Jer, Bush Is effective in SQUEEZING the islamofasist puss
February 1, 2008 - 01:44 ET by upcountrywaterfrom the madrassas, that has built up over the 8 year clinton-break from history.
So obamba will have some free time while puss pressure builds again
iranian uranium; iranian uranium, iranian uranium..
Cha, cha, change, it's a comming. <all computer screens are now blank & black> screw YOUR change
Yeah, O.K...now I get it.
February 1, 2008 - 02:57 ET by JerYeah, O.K...now I get it. I've always found "festering sores" analogies to be particularly instructive.
Jer
Do you have a better
February 1, 2008 - 03:00 ET by Gary P JacksonDo you have a better description for these savages?
Nope...I think upcountry's
February 1, 2008 - 03:05 ET by JerNope...I think upcountry's eloquence is in a class by itself.
Jer
Even McCain should be able
February 1, 2008 - 00:57 ET by fitzfongEven McCain should be able to clobber either of these two brain donors.
Who would have ever
February 1, 2008 - 01:28 ET by USA4freedomWho would have ever guessed...!!!!What a total joke. http://thehill.com/leading-the-news/democrats-say-mccain-nearly-abandoned-gop-2007-03-28.html
These are the boys of Pointe du Hoc. Ronald Reagan- 40th Anniversary of D-Day
Mitt Romney's new ad that
February 1, 2008 - 02:59 ET by Gary P JacksonMitt Romney's new ad that came out today and reminded everyone that McCain had serious talks with John Kerry about being his running mate.
The ad basically shows McCain is left of Hillary Clinton!
If this is true, then it
February 1, 2008 - 09:56 ET by lotrIf this is true, then it looks like Mitt is getting pretty desperate.
It's "desperate" to reveal the real McCain?
February 1, 2008 - 10:07 ET by RJNot hardly. I say go for it, Mitt. If the "moderates" and "independents" want this man for President, at least show them what kind of an unprincipled man they're voting for.
The only solid, firm principle McCain has is Iraq (and he's willing to lie about even that). Everything else is up for negotiation.
"I really like Mike Huckabee." -uber lib Mika Brezinski
→ RJ
February 1, 2008 - 10:19 ET by Cool ArrowI agree. If Mitt really wants to be President, he's going to have to expose McCain. The media won't pay attention unless there's something controversial in his ads or statements.
He certainly won't get anywhere trying to outMcCain McCain.
♣ a seal
McCain more liberal than
February 1, 2008 - 11:21 ET by lotrMcCain more liberal than Hillary? Give me a break. I guess we should all become Democrats then.
Clinton-Obama '08. I watched their debate last night -- Obama favors issuing driver's licenses to illegals, Hillary flip-flopped on the issue. Off the top of my head: Both would have comparatively flacid foreign policies, not unlike the Democrats of recent years -- this is where Lieberman broke ranks. Both are tow-the-line, unmitigated pro-choice (Obama being in favor of compassionately letting the "abortus" die on the table if born alive) -- this is high priority given the critical balance of the Supreme Court. Both are in favor of repealing Bush tax cuts; Obama in favor of increasing taxes substantially over the pre-Bush levels. Both are in favor of socialized health care or one form or another. Both are anti-traditional values. And they aren't 9/11 conspiracy theorists -- give 'em credit! Yep, they are the true conservatives compared to McCain, I'm convinced. I'm switching sides.
Get a grip. It has nothing to do with who "we" (realists) want -- who we want is not always who were gonna get. Reagan, God rest his soul, had great charisma. That got him elected two-terms, along with his VP for one term. Same goes for Clinton-I -- that's why he's out campaigning for his wife. I want Alan Keyes -- he simply blows the former governor of Mass. out of the water on nearly every count except that most crucial of political criteria, electibility. He lost to Obama in a landslide -- sad, but true. I preferred and voted for him over GWB in 2000, but I conceded that GWB was far more electable, even if he was more moderate. Thank God, GWB got the nomination, for he was elected (but it was still agonizingly close), and we got a moderate-conservative, rather than liberal Algore, for 8 years. But that will soon all be undone, because we've got McDS, and we are probably going to end up with Hillary-Obama.
Try arguing against something I actually said, lotr
February 1, 2008 - 11:30 ET by RJ...instead of that long rant against whatever you think you read.
Did I say McCain is more liberal than Hillary? Did I say any of the things you argue against?
Give it another shot.
"He was a would be sharp operator who lacked for the satisfaction of his ambition only the quality of sharpness and who expended all of his energies on perserving his opinions from contamination." -Michael Chabon, "Gentlemen of the Road"
Sorry about the rant (not my
February 1, 2008 - 13:24 ET by lotrSorry about the rant (not my style, usually), but it's contagious.
The poster above said:
"The ad basically shows McCain is left of Hillary Clinton!"
To which I commented: "If this is true, then it looks like Mitt is getting pretty desperate."
Which summoned the following from you, RJ: "Not hardly. I say go for it, Mitt."
So I surmised that you agreed that McCain is more liberal than Hillary, but I'm very glad to see I'm wrong in this.
So I apologize for ranting, but I've become very concerned that the Democrats will win, and this has me agitated. I watched their debate last night, and it was nauseating. The mainstream of the Democratic Party is lining up behind either one of these two liberal candidates -- they are even now promoting the "dream team." Meanwhile, we have people here who seem to not care, or not fully comprehend just how disastrous either of these two would be. Newt last night on Hannity and Colmes (transcript hopefully forthcoming) summed it up quite nicely: While McCain might not be the first choice in an ideal conservative world (he wasn't my first choice either), he is still far better (in Newt's own words) than Hillary or Obama.
Thanks, lotr
February 1, 2008 - 13:37 ET by RJMy main point was that it's about time Romney began exposing the real McCain.
Just so you know for sure, I think McCain is a despicable, petty, vindictive and unprincipled man. As I said, I think the only solid, firm principle McCain has is Iraq (and he's willing to lie about even that). For him, everything else is up for negotiation.
Having said all that, as it stands now, I'll probably vote for him if he's the nominee. His position on Iraq is the only thing that would allow me to vote for him and still keep my self-respect.
Of course, I keep the option to walk away in disgust if he manages to piss me off enough.
Yes, he stood by the Iraq
February 1, 2008 - 14:20 ET by lotrYes, he stood by the Iraq war policy when others, including the entire MSM and reputable Republicans, wrote it off as a loss. He stood on his pro-America/anti-terrorist principles despite it being highly unpopular. It cost him, too: "the straight talk express has lost some of his wheels" -- Obama, referring to McCain's war policy. So I simply don't share your view on him, although it might come close to my sentiments about Hill-Bill. Even if you are correct about him being "unprincipled" in other areas, I'm not altogether convinced that Romney would be any better.
One other thing: I realize now, perhaps after debating this on NB, that the single most important issue is pro-life. Call me a "right-wing religious fanatic" (even though I believe the issue is humanitarian, not sectarian), but that's my (and my spouse's) litmus test. I've researched McCain, and he passes the test. So we are backing him; pray that he (or Mitt, God willing) wins in November.
"Sorry about the rant (not
February 1, 2008 - 14:31 ET by ckc1227"Sorry about the rant (not my style, usually), but it's contagious."
Though your target may have been wrong, what you said was spot on. Those saying McCain is just as bad as the other 2 aren't paying attention. He's not my favorite by far, but I'm no dummy. There are significant differences.
And for those who are betting that things will get so bad that America will kick the Dems out in 2012, I have to ask, how'd that work out in 2006? Republican apathy gave control of Congress to the Dems, yet I don't see them getting booted this year. If anything, Republican apathy is going to result in them gaining even more seats this time, and the die will be cast for decades to come.
No offense, but that's one hell of a gamble to take with the hope that another once-in-a-lifetime candidate materializes out of the blue in 4 years simply because voters "taught them Republicans a lesson". What if there is no next-Reagan out there? If there is, I'd like to limit the damage to this country as much as possible until we find him/her, which is completely different from those who seem to think we have to destroy this country as much as possible until we find him.
It's damn frustrating to see so many people who believe choosing life is the best policy are so willing to choose death in this situation. It's really sad.
Thanks Kevin. Good to see
February 1, 2008 - 16:34 ET by lotrThanks Kevin. Good to see I'm not totally losing my mind here.
I think CNN needed to include...
February 1, 2008 - 09:49 ET by krendlerI think CNN needed to include a few dozen more shots of celebrities in the audience looking thoughtful (e.g., Annie Hall and the guy from Grey's Anatomy who was fired for bashing gays).
How superficial. And how appropriate, given the "conversation" and the candidates on stage (especially Mr. Pep-Rally, Soaring-Speech, 1/2 term senator Obama).
→ krendler
February 1, 2008 - 09:52 ET by Cool ArrowIsaiah Washington was there as part of a community service agreement, I'm sure.
♣ a seal